More To Come On This…

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  • #118630

    This is what I was referring to Kevin. I didn’t mean to offend anyone.

    #118655

    In the work place, all those sexist and bigoted bosses are finally being held accountable for their words and deeds after many years of capitulation because employees feared retaliation or the loss of their jobs.

    Athletes also fear retaliation. Perhaps they feel forced to capitulate to (or at least tolerate) a coach’s viewpoints because of the power they hold? Such as: Do they start, how much do they play, what they tell scouts about the player, etc?

    In a lecture setting, a student can still pass a test or a class without having to agree with the professor’s personal point of view on religion, politics, prejudice, etc. The answer is either right or wrong; the professor’s bias cannot enter into the equation.

    That’s the main difference that I see. A professor does not hold the power because a student can still get an “A” on a test despite possible disparities in their belief systems.

    Also, coaches are mentors and much more involved in an athletes personal life and time outside the athletic program. Whereas professors only see students during lecture or lab. They aren’t involved in their day to day life. Much harder to try and indoctrinate someone you rarely see.

    #118656

    In the work place, all those sexist and bigoted bosses are finally being held accountable for their words and deeds after many years of capitulation because employees feared retaliation or the loss of their jobs.

    Athletes also fear retaliation. Perhaps they feel forced to capitulate to (or at least tolerate) a coach’s viewpoints because of the power they hold? Such as: Do they start, how much do they play, what they tell scouts about the player, etc?

    In a lecture setting, a student can still pass a test or a class without having to agree with the professor’s personal point of view on religion, politics, prejudice, etc. The answer is either right or wrong; the professor’s bias cannot enter into the equation.

    That’s the main difference that I see. A professor does not hold the power because a student can still get an “A” on a test despite possible disparities in their belief systems.

    Also, coaches are mentors and much more involved in an athletes personal life and time outside the athletic program. Whereas professors only see students during lecture or lab. They aren’t involved in their day to day life. Much harder to try and indoctrinate someone you rarely see.

    Jeff:

    When a professor gives essay type tests, that is where they can and do impose their belief system upon the student.  And that type of testing is very common – it was even very common back in the Dark Ages when I attended school.

    #118659

    I agree with WVFaninMi.  There may be right or wrong answers in math and science, at least as it relates to our current state of knowledge, but the soft sciences are full of subjective subjects and answers.  There are certainly abuses going on in those situations that are not so easily resolved due to how our education system has evolved over time.  Still, I do not think that a coach and a professor have exactly the same relationship status that exists between a professor and a student.

    #118660

    Jeff, you are wrong.  Very wrong.  Even in the 70’s students that were very conservative were chastised not only by professors, but by other students.  You’re way too young to remember veterans being spit on when they returned from Viet Nam.  Even kids coming home with severe injuries from the Iraq War were looked at as sub human.

    This PC movement has gotten out of hand.  Young people have been indoctrinated into the fascist movement by the media to the point that they don’t know that many of the statues of the generals / presidents / lawmakers that they are pulling down are the same people that fought for equal rights for all.

    There are ways to settle things without putting it out there that destroys the reputation of the coaches that are mentoring you thru life.  This is way out of hand and it needs to stop.

    #118662

    I guarantee that the vast majority of Americans are sick over events now transpiring before our eyes, but in this pop culture and media world of today, if you speak out you will be under intense attack.  No other opinions are tolerated, yet we bow to diversity and inclusion.  The very meaning of both words has been coopted to mean that if you’re diverse you belong to a single mind set, and if you’re inclusive you only include those of the same mind set and opinions.

    Why are things this way?  Because of the education system and because of the media, BOTH of which have become echo chambers for group think.

    With all of that said, the vast majority of folks who are staying silent in order to keep from being singled out and attacked, are eventually going to get upset enough to push back and say no more and do more than verbalize it, they may just take to the streets themselves.  And that will be letting a genie out of the bottle that will not be easily put back in the bottle, if at all.

    #118666

    I’m with Jeff.

    #118667

    I think Jeff makes good points in his 1st 2 paragraphs.  But I also think that you could see the world completely differently than Jeff does and still think that sexist and bigoted bosses are a bad thing.  Unfortunately, too many people in today’s society think that if you do not agree completely with Jeff you are incapable of being against sexist and bigoted bosses.

    I would take exception with Jeff’s use of the word “all” in his 1st 2 paragraphs.  There is no doubt in my mind that those standards are selectively applied, often depending on what your other beliefs are.

    Lastly, I have already voiced my disagreement that biases can, and do, impact grades students receive when the grade is based on the subjective interpretation of the material submitted.   That seems like a no brainer to me.  No offense intended.  Perhaps this suggestion is just a relic of a former time, but we may have to agree to disagree about that one.

    One professor, taken in isolation, may not be able to indoctrinate a student.  Many professors, taken over many hours of contact per week, over several years, may start to have an impact.  And that influence does not begin only in college.  It happens thru the prior years of education as well.

    #118669

    John Prine wrote the greatest song about veterans that I know.  Sam Stone was a song that showed his empathy for veterans while also subtly thumbing his nose at both hawks and doves.

    #118681

    Mea culpa. I did not take into account “essay” type questions on test, where bias is certainly involved.

    So I can see where grades could be affected if a student does not buy into a professor’s point of view to pass a class.

    But I still maintain my point: Coaches hold much more power over an athlete under their watch than a professor does over a student in their class.

    #118682

    I’m not sure that I understand the coach having more power argument.  Coaches have a direct incentive to see you succeed that professors do not.  If a coach benches all his most talented players because of politics and the product on the field suffers, he’s going to suffer the consequences.  If a women’s studies professor gives all male students an automatic letter cut, it doesn’t affect her career in the least.

    #118683

    Also the idea that players live in fear of what coaches will tell scouts…  you don’t think many professors have the same power?  Students can be blackballed by professors in a way that would affect entry into a program, grad school, position within a college or even employment afterwards.  They have way more power than just grading a scantron.

     

    #118693

     

    Mea culpa. I did not take into account “essay” type questions on test, where bias is certainly involved.

    So I can see where grades could be affected if a student does not buy into a professor’s point of view to pass a class.

    But I still maintain my point: Coaches hold much more power over an athlete under their watch than a professor does over a student in their class.

    Jeff, you just don’t get it.  It’s not just grading an essay.  It’s the whole think tank mentality of the educational system that leans way too far toward socialism.  If you’re a conservative, Christian, in ROTC or otherwise don’t believe socialism and government control over your life is best you are bombarded with a far left view every day in most every class by most every professor in college. Cinci said it best.

    One professor, taken in isolation, may not be able to indoctrinate a student.  Many professors, taken over many hours of contact per week, over several years, may start to have an impact.  And that influence does not begin only in college.  It happens thru the prior years of education as well.

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